Exploring the mystical and the material, balancing transformation and preservation, 21-year-old San Francisco shoegazer Wisp sheds her skin on her self-affirming debut record, ‘If Not Winter.’

Stream: ‘If Not Winter’ – Wisp

If there’s a defining quality to the state of shoegaze music in 2025, it’s that the conversation around it is polarizing.

Another, is that it’s become ubiquitous, and Gen-Z can’t seem to get enough.

For those in the know, Wisp, the moniker of 21-year-old Natalie Lu, is the name on everyone’s lips. Not purely nostalgic, but not exactly future-forward either, the San Francisco songstress, like the genre she’s come to represent, isn’t just a part of shoegaze’s contemporary revival — she’s leading it.

Wisp joins our Zoom from Los Angeles on a slow Tuesday afternoon, four jam-packed days following the release of her record, and one day ahead of her twenty-first birthday. She dials in as Natalie, a girl who she claims isn’t too different from the mysterious and brooding character of Wisp. Gentle-mannered and soft-spoken, yet communicating with sheer poise and conviction, she’s intentional with each word, not hesitating to bare her fragility or prove her strength, whether it’s as a young woman learning to navigate the world, or a burgeoning musician leaving her mark on an unrelenting industry.

“I just want to show people through my music that I am a real artist, and that I can make music as good as these other bands,” she expresses palpable frustration with naysayers and elitists. “I have definitely dealt with people who don’t really give my music a chance, and I feel like I have enough supporters and enough love around me to not need to please everyone in the shoegaze genre, especially the peers. At this point, I’m very comfortable in the way that I’m expanding and growing, and I’m very appreciative of the people in my fan base and the people that are new to my fan base, because they’re all open-minded people.”

An artist’s first official release is rarely one that gains global virality and turbulently propels them into the public spotlight. Whether by fate, or by coincidence, or by an unceasing sequence of events, that was the case for the computer science student-turned-overnight-rockstar. Albeit not without its fair share of critiques and challenges, the singer continues to prove her place in the face of a rigid scene and unforgiving landscape. Two years, a one-hundred-million-streaming hit, and a six-track EP later, Lu confidently arrives with her debut album, If Not Winter, a sleek yet striking collection of journal entries backgrounded by medieval imagery, literary texts, distorted guitars, and blissed-out vocals.

If Not Winter - Wisp — If Not Winter – Wisp

“You only get a debut album once, and I wanted it to be perfect,” Wisp admits. “I didn’t want to regret any of the songs that I put out on this album… in terms of experimenting and writing whatever I wanted to write, If Not Winter is definitely more experimental. I exercised my creativity a lot more on the album.”

She continues, reflecting on her artistic and personal journey, “I’m giving myself the opportunity to be very vulnerable with my lyric-writing and my songwriting as well, because all these songs are very personal to things that happened to me, my situations, and the people that came into my life and left my life. I’m showing my own story of personal growth and reflection on who I am as a person, and how I’ve grown over this past year of writing the album.”

And her growth is undeniable, but it doesn’t just stop at music; she grapples with identity, connection, and authenticity, forging imagination, contemplation, and wonder to capture the magic and materiality of her inner universe. We took a couple of minutes to gush over the project’s inspirations, which range from her childhood affinity for the wizarding world to Sappho’s prolific musings on passion, desire, and devotion.

“I liked the fact that she existed centuries and centuries ago, and her poetry and her words read like modern art,” Wisp professes her admiration for Sappho’s poetry, which the title of her debut project draws from. “I think that’s really special… people in the past have felt exactly the same way we do. It’s really special – that love, and limerence, and sacrifice, and infatuation. They’ve been a thing for so long, and they’re just parts of being human.”

Harbouring a deep appreciation for art and those who produce it, she never fails to give her idols and contemporaries their flowers. Striving for connection and continuity across and within generations, Lu reaffirms the importance of music in her life, not just as a cornerstone in her creative expression, but as a source of energy and exchange.

Here, Atwood Magazine catches up with Wisp as she unveils the importance of liberation from genre expectations, bridging fantasy and reality, and what it means to be unmistakably herself.

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:: stream/purchase If Not Winter here ::

:: connect with Wisp here ::

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A CONVERSATION WITH WISP

ATWOOD MAGAZINE: CONGRATS ON THE NEW RECORD! HOW DO YOU FEEL A FEW DAYS POST-RELEASE? HOW HAS THE RECEPTION BEEN?

Wisp: I feel good! It was definitely very overwhelming in the beginning. I feel like I had a lot of time to process the album coming out, but it actually coming out was a totally different feeling than what I was expecting. But, I felt so much love, gratitude, and appreciation for everyone around me: my managers and my team, and obviously my fans as well. The album has been really well-received so far. Hopefully, more people are able to find it, and I hope people are enjoying it so far.

I always get the same feeling, especially when I release singles and there’s a music video premiere. When I released the Pandora EP with the music video, and even just the “Sword” one as well, I feel this very special type of excitement where you’re like, “Oh, I wonder how many people are going to watch the YouTube premiere. I wonder how well the streams are going to do afterwards.” With this album, I was less worried about how many people would see it and listen to it. I was kind of just really overwhelmed that my debut album is coming out. Just reflecting on that was a lot for me, but it was really, really exciting.

IN THE PAST, YOU REFERRED TO PANDORA AS A PROJECT MORE FOR THE FANS THAN IT WAS FOR YOURSELF. WITH IF NOT WINTER, OBVIOUSLY, AUTHENTICITY AND YOUR PERSONAL CONNECTION TO YOUR WORK WERE AT THE FOREFRONT. DID YOU FEEL LIKE YOU WERE COMPROMISING WHAT YOU WANTED TO DO AND HIDING YOURSELF AT ANY POINT BACK THEN?

Wisp: Not consciously, but I will admit that If Not Winter is definitely more personal to me. Obviously, I put a lot more time into this album compared to Pandora, just because I had more leniency with time. Also, you only get a debut album once, and I wanted it to be perfect. I didn’t want to regret any of the songs that I put out on this album. I feel like I was very proud of Pandora, and I still am, but I definitely saw it as a collection of songs that I really enjoyed, and I don’t think that they necessarily made sense with each other. I knew that people would like some of the tracks on there as well, so I feel like, in terms of experimenting and writing whatever I wanted to write, If Not Winter is definitely more experimental. I exercised my creativity a lot more on the album.

WAS THAT CATHARTIC?

Wisp: Music has always been kind of a therapy and a way for me to express my feelings and feel better about my life circumstances or my emotions. Getting to write the album, having it out, and having other people listen to it feels like I’m sharing my thoughts and my feelings with people who might be going through the same thing that I went through. In that way, it’s a really special connection to make with my fans, because I feel like we can relate to each other on a more personal level now. For me, that’s very healing too.

AT SOME POINT, YOU MENTIONED THE STRUGGLE OF GOING FROM WRITING SINGLES TO MAKING A COHESIVE ALBUM, ESPECIALLY SINCE, IN YOUR CASE, YOU WANTED YOUR ALBUM TO TELL A STORY. WHAT WAS THE STORY YOU WANTED TO TELL THROUGH IF NOT WINTER?

Wisp: I didn’t necessarily want to tell a narrative or a well-written story, just because I feel like if I wrote characters or if I wrote specific scenes, it wouldn’t really pertain to my life. If we do view it as kind of like a storybook, I would say I’m the only character, and the story I’m trying to tell is showing people my diary entries, my journal entries, and letting them have a personal look into my life and my experiences. I’m giving myself the opportunity to be very vulnerable with my lyric-writing and my songwriting as well, because all these songs are very personal to things that happened to me, my situations, and the people that came into my life and left my life. I’m showing my own story of personal growth and reflection on who I am as a person, and how I’ve grown over this past year of writing the album. That was my goal.

OBVIOUSLY THERE’S THAT REALISTIC ELEMENT, GIVEN THAT THE ALBUM IS ABOUT YOUR PERSONAL EXPERIENCES, BUT THERE’S ALSO A FANTASTICAL, MYSTICAL ELEMENT TOO, AS SEEN THROUGH THE VISUALS THAT YOU PUT OUT. WHAT ROLE DOES FANTASY PLAY IN COMMUNICATING YOUR REALITY?

Wisp: I think because the stories are so real, and because this is a reality that a lot of people can relate to, I wanted the visuals to be striking and just generally different than what the music is about — kind of pertaining to this fantasy world and connecting it to a song that is very real and true to a lot of people. Having that contrast is really cool. I have had all these fantasies and dreams growing up as a child to be a princess, or a mermaid, or whatever it is that my heart desired, and being able to bring those fantasies into my music now allows it to have an even more personal connection. It kind of feels like I’m bringing my fantasies into reality.

IS THERE A WISP WORLD THAT YOU’RE TRYING TO BUILD? ARE YOU CREATING OR EXPANDING ON ANY LORE?

Wisp: I think this is definitely the world that I’ve been building from the very beginning up until now. At the beginning of Wisp, I had a very clear vision of wanting it to be very underwater with themes of the ocean and mermaids. That’s because that was one of my fantasies growing up: wanting to be a mermaid. Now, obviously, it’s not really water-themed anymore, but we’re kind of straying into different fantasies that stay in the same world. I want to continue exploring that and really allow myself to express these very visceral and unreal environments in my music.

ON THE TOPIC OF UNREAL ENVIRONMENTS, I READ THAT HARRY POTTER WAS A HUGE PART OF THIS RECORD. WHAT’S YOUR HOUSE?

Wisp: I’m a Hufflepuff!

I DIDN’T EXPECT THAT! DO YOU RESONATE WITH IT?

Wisp: I grew up taking the official test almost every year! Every year, up until this year, actually, I got Hufflepuff. This year, I got Slytherin. I’m a little conflicted, but I personally think I’m still a Hufflepuff.

WHILE WE’RE STILL ON BOOKS, I KNOW THE TITLE OF THE ALBUM, IF NOT WINTER, COMES FROM SAPPHO. I’M CURIOUS AS A BIT OF A LIT NERD MYSELF; WHERE DO YOU THINK THE THEMES OF THIS BOOK MANIFEST OR REALLY SHOW UP IN THE RECORD?

Wisp: It’s not necessarily the deep things that she was writing about and the themes of the book, although that is a very big part of it as well. I liked the fact that she existed centuries and centuries ago, and her poetry and her words read like modern art. I think that’s really special. It really stuck with me, because if we can feel these things now, and if people can relate to her words, then that means that these feelings have existed for so many years. They’re just a natural thing to feel, and people in the past have felt exactly the same way we do. It’s really special — that love, and limerence, and sacrifice, and infatuation. They’ve been a thing for so long, and they’re just parts of being human.

I ALSO WANTED TO TALK ABOUT SOME SPECIFIC SONGS. NOT TO JUMP STRAIGHT TO THE CLOSER, BUT “ALL I NEED” IS QUITE INTERESTING TO ME; I LOVE HOW YOU’RE FORAYING INTO MORE ACOUSTIC STUFF. DID YOU FEEL LIKE IT WAS DIFFICULT TO JUMP STYLES, OR WAS THERE EVER A SENSE OF SACRIFICE?

Wisp: I don’t think so. With this album, I made sure that I was staying true to myself and I was writing whatever I wanted to write, whether that meant stuff that is similar to my past music or stuff that I’ve never tried before. “All i need,” the acoustic track, is something that I started writing because I originally came from playing acoustic guitar and just doing singer-songwriter stuff in my bedroom. It was kind of like an homage back to my beginning days of music, way before Wisp. I thought that was the perfect way to end the album, because it felt like a time capsule for me, and I think it also really showed the viewers where I come from. It’s also a very nostalgic feeling for me to listen to that song as well.

AS YOU KNOW, THERE’S A FAIR AMOUNT OF DISCOURSE AROUND GEN Z MAKING SHOEGAZE MUSIC, SEEING AS THE GENRE IS EXTREMELY DOMINATED BY OLDER WHITE MEN. BEING A YOUNG ASIAN WOMAN PROBABLY ADDS A DIFFERENT CHALLENGE ON TOP OF THAT, SINCE THERE ARE EVEN FEWER OF US IN THIS SPACE. HAS YOUR CULTURAL BACKGROUND INFORMED THE WAY YOU APPROACH MUSIC IN ANY WAY?

Wisp: I think so. I don’t think that it directly influences the way that I perceive myself, and also the way that I put myself out to others, but I have seen a couple comments where people are saying that it is easier for me to grow a fanbase and to be in the spotlight because of my cultural background and because I am a woman. When I read stuff like that, it seems a bit insensitive, just because this genre was built on predominantly older white men in bands. Although there are more of them, and that could make me stand out, I think that they have a lot more respect because their faces and images are seen as real musicians who make real music. That’s something that I’ve been struggling to prove to people, just because I am Asian, and because I am a woman. I try not to make it the full focus of my brand, obviously. I just want to show people through my music that I am a real artist, and that I can make music as good as these other bands.

IT REALLY DISCREDITS THE MERIT OF YOUR WORK AND YOUR MUSIC, WHICH IS AN UNFORTUNATE REALITY FOR MINORITIES IN A LOT OF CREATIVE SPACES. HAVE YOU FOUND THAT IT’S GOTTEN BETTER AS YOU’VE PROGRESSED IN YOUR CAREER?

Wisp: A lot of people will always be stubborn about the way that I started making music, and I understand how it could be a bit off-putting to other people, but I think as long as true shoegaze fans and listeners have an open mind, then that’s amazing! If they don’t, it’s okay. I have definitely dealt with people who don’t really give my music a chance, and I feel like I have enough supporters and enough love around me to not need to please everyone in the shoegaze genre, especially the peers. At this point, I’m very comfortable in the way that I’m expanding and growing, and I’m very appreciative of the people in my fan base and the people that are new to my fan base, because they’re all open-minded people. They’re all very loving, and they hear me, so it’s great.

YOU TOUCH ON THIS A BIT IN “BLACK SWAN,” BUT BEING THRUST INTO THE PUBLIC EYE SO ABRUPTLY COULDN’T HAVE BEEN EASY. IT’S DEFINITELY EASIER SAID THAN DONE TO NOT OVERTHINK ABOUT YOUR IMAGE AND PHYSICAL APPEARANCE, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU’RE A GIRL, BUT HOW HAS YOUR SELF-IMAGE EVOLVED AND CHANGED?

Wisp: In the beginning, it was a bit daunting, just because I had originally wanted to be an artist that wasn’t face-forward. Once I started sharing my face online, I was getting more comfortable with it, and it is a very important aspect of my music now. I feel like having that connection with people in real life, seeing people face-to-face, and talking with them face-to-face is just so authentic, and it just feels very special to me. It definitely is difficult seeing different angles of me in pictures and videos after every show, and kind of dealing with dysmorphia and insecurity in the physical aspects of everything.

I’ve definitely grown to be more confident in myself, my personality, and my looks, but it’s definitely something that I’m still trying to become more confident in. I feel like I just need to be more lenient with myself. Everyone will always kind of have that feeling in the back of their head, and all you can do is just affirm yourself that you have so much to give and so much to show, not just for other people, but for yourself, and to feel good about who you are. That’s something that I try to remind myself every day.

IS THERE A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WISP AND NATALIE? DO YOU FEEL LIKE THERE’S A SEPARATION BETWEEN YOUR ARTISTIC AND PERSONAL SELF?

Wisp: Definitely. In the beginning, the gap between the two was larger, but nowadays, I think that gap is slowly closing, just because I’m putting more of myself into my music. I’m allowing myself to be a bit more goofy around fans and not have this guard up and try to perform and be overtly someone that is not 100% me. I think that what the fans are getting now is Natalie, and it is also Wisp.

BACK TO THE TRACKS FOR A BIT, “SERPENTINE” IS A REALLY UPBEAT ADDITION TO THE PROJECT; IT KIND OF FEELS LIKE THE PERFECT LATE SUMMER SONG, AND I’VE BEEN REALLY ENJOYING IT. TELL ME MORE ABOUT THAT ONE.

Wisp: I wrote “Serpentine” with Darcy and Max, and originally, it had this vocal melody that Darcy wrote. I wasn’t super attached to it, just because it didn’t fit my voice. I kind of rediscovered the song a couple of months later, and we rewrote a bit of the drum parts, the guitar parts, I wrote new vocal melodies and lyrics, and it became what it is today! I think the reason why we looked back on that song was because it, originally, from the start, had this very summery feeling, like you said, and I felt that that was exactly what the album was lacking. I really wanted the album to have at least a couple of feel-good songs that people could dance to and just not take too seriously.

WHAT WERE SOME OF THE CHALLENGES YOU FACED IN THE PROCESS OF MAKING THE ALBUM?

Wisp: It was just me being satisfied with the music, because writing the album was within almost one and a half years. I would write a track, fall in love with it, listen to it over and over, tell myself it was 100% going on the album, and then a couple of weeks later, I would end up hating it and being like, “I can write something better.” It was this repetitive cycle of, “I love it. I don’t love it. I can write something better.” It was just me overthinking, kind of getting in my head about my abilities, my strength as a musician, and kind of figuring out what I wanted to say with the album as a whole. I got over that by just listening to myself and not letting outside opinions sway what songs I liked and what songs I didn’t. If I had a song that I was visiting months and months later that I still loved, then it would make it onto the album!

I probably wrote about 60 songs, but even out of those, it was difficult for me to choose even five that I liked at the time. I continued to write more music, and I think on the very last stretch, I was like, “Okay, I know which ones I like now,” and I was able to put them together to make sense. Every song you see on the album is a song that I never second-guessed, and that I truly believed belonged on this project.

I KNOW YOU TALKED ABOUT JOURNALING FOR INSPIRATION AS SOON AS YOU WOKE UP EVERY MORNING TOO. DID ANY JOURNAL ENTRIES STICK WITH YOU IMMEDIATELY? WERE YOU EVER LIKE, “I HAVE TO MAKE THIS ONE A SONG,” OR DID YOU HAVE TO SIT ON EVERY ONE?

Wisp: A couple of them definitely stuck with me, and I took them to the studio right away and wrote a song based on my journal entries. On “Black swan,” one of my literal journal entries made it into the spoken word part. That part was just me reading off my actual journal, which is one of my favourite details on the album. If I think it makes sense, and if it’s something I’m feeling very heavily that morning, then I’ll definitely write about it.

LAST IS A QUESTION FOR THE PEOPLE, AS PER HUNDREDS OF TIKTOK COMMENTS I READ: “YELLOW” COVER WHEN?

Wisp: [laughs] I actually got a text about it from my manager today, and she asked me if I would want to put out that cover of “Yellow” during tour, so maybe in a month, it might be out! I wasn’t really expecting people to make videos to it and like it that much. It’s pretty cool. I kind of just wrote it for fun when I went to the studio, and I didn’t want to write a new song. I’ll put it out like, pretty soon.

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